@C.Lundin I haven't planned to arrange it myself. I have a carpenter who will hopefully do it (the ones who assembled the house), either hired by me or the foundation contractor.
But since my trust in builders is somewhere just below zero now due to the previously mentioned foundation contractor, I want to know exactly how it should be done before anyone places a jack under the house.
However, it should be said that the carpenters seem thorough and meticulous, but they also haven't done exactly this before, hence my question on this eminent forum.
What problems can I expect besides cracked surface layers?
Thanks for the involvement so far.
But since my trust in builders is somewhere just below zero now due to the previously mentioned foundation contractor, I want to know exactly how it should be done before anyone places a jack under the house.
However, it should be said that the carpenters seem thorough and meticulous, but they also haven't done exactly this before, hence my question on this eminent forum.
What problems can I expect besides cracked surface layers?
Thanks for the involvement so far.
Seriously, I see the mistake the carpenters made as more serious. A foundation slab with a 16 mm deviation is not good, but not entirely uncommon and nothing remarkable.
However, that the carpenters erected the entire house without checking the foundation and shimming for it, and checking that the beams and walls are level and plumb, is significantly worse.
Furthermore, the walls hardly lean more than the allowable limit due to a 16 mm height difference over the entire house length. The angle error due to that height difference will not be many mm on a 2.5-meter wall.
However, that the carpenters erected the entire house without checking the foundation and shimming for it, and checking that the beams and walls are level and plumb, is significantly worse.
Furthermore, the walls hardly lean more than the allowable limit due to a 16 mm height difference over the entire house length. The angle error due to that height difference will not be many mm on a 2.5-meter wall.
@falkn I don't really agree.
The carpenters work in a factory in Hjältevad and assume that the foundation has a tolerance of +- 3mm, which is clearly stated on the foundation drawing. The ground floor comes in two large volumes (13.5x4.2 meters) and is placed with a crane on the foundation. The volumes have bottom floor, intermediate floor, exterior walls, interior walls, electricity, and water when they arrive.
There is a difference of 16mm (or maybe it was 17) between the corners on one gable (7.6 meters). However, it tilts 11mm over 2.5m at the worst spot (so the beer rolls away if it tips over there).
Regarding the tilt of the outer wall, my understanding is that it is explained by the tilt of the foundation/floor. From roughly the middle of the house to one long side (3.6 meters), there is a difference of 10mm. At the wall's height (2.5 meters), this makes 7mm (10/3.6*2.5), which is slightly less than the tilt I measured (10mm) but more than AMA allows (5mm).
The carpenters work in a factory in Hjältevad and assume that the foundation has a tolerance of +- 3mm, which is clearly stated on the foundation drawing. The ground floor comes in two large volumes (13.5x4.2 meters) and is placed with a crane on the foundation. The volumes have bottom floor, intermediate floor, exterior walls, interior walls, electricity, and water when they arrive.
There is a difference of 16mm (or maybe it was 17) between the corners on one gable (7.6 meters). However, it tilts 11mm over 2.5m at the worst spot (so the beer rolls away if it tips over there).
Regarding the tilt of the outer wall, my understanding is that it is explained by the tilt of the foundation/floor. From roughly the middle of the house to one long side (3.6 meters), there is a difference of 10mm. At the wall's height (2.5 meters), this makes 7mm (10/3.6*2.5), which is slightly less than the tilt I measured (10mm) but more than AMA allows (5mm).
A serious carpenter obviously checks this before installation. Similarly, when we erect frames (concrete) at work. We level and shim. That they assemble the entire house without checking level and plumb even once is remarkably deficient. Things may have happened in the factory or during transport that requires an adjustment.frma71 said:
Do what you want, but I would let this go if I were you. I think you will find it difficult to hold the foundation contractor accountable at this stage.
Member
· Västernorrland
· 12 021 posts
No, even if the foundation is as it is, the responsibility lies entirely with those who placed the house on the foundation and didn't measure and prop it up beforehand. 16mm, as mentioned, is not much if you look at the casting itself.
I disagree.
The blueprint that forms the basis of our agreement specifies a tolerance of +- 3mm. That is not what they have delivered. As far as I understand, the KTjL also applies to foundation contractors
Besides that, he has submitted a measurement protocol to the house supplier which obviously does not match reality, which is very close to false certification.
On what grounds can I hold the house supplier responsible for this if the foundation I provide (through my foundation contractor) obviously does not meet the requirements they set?
The blueprint that forms the basis of our agreement specifies a tolerance of +- 3mm. That is not what they have delivered. As far as I understand, the KTjL also applies to foundation contractors
Besides that, he has submitted a measurement protocol to the house supplier which obviously does not match reality, which is very close to false certification.
On what grounds can I hold the house supplier responsible for this if the foundation I provide (through my foundation contractor) obviously does not meet the requirements they set?
Member
· Västernorrland
· 12 021 posts
Sure, you can argue that they cast it incorrectly according to the contract, but those who placed the building structure should never have proceeded with the construction in that case. Otherwise, it's like a car painter painting a car with large rust holes because he was informed that all the rust had been repaired.
@Stefan1972 Sure, you might think it's unprofessional and I would certainly like to hold the house supplier accountable, but I'm not really sure on what grounds.
They'll probably claim that they received a signed measurement protocol certifying that the foundation was correctly executed.
They'll probably claim that they received a signed measurement protocol certifying that the foundation was correctly executed.
Member
· Västernorrland
· 12 021 posts
claim? Have they received such a thing or what? Personally, I have no idea about the procedures in such constructions. Does everyone trust everyone and do what they're supposed to, or what's customary? If I were to build a house on a foundation, it almost feels like the instinct for self-preservation would be so strong that I would check everything even if I had someone else's assurance, but that's just me...........
You write the foundation and walls. It will soon be 16 mm, even though everything is within tolerance. You have more than 3 mm on a slab if that's what you mean. Then you have tolerance on the wall whether it is now bricked or cast. Then there are additional assembly and manufacturing tolerances from the house supplier.
@Stefan1972 Yes, the house supplier has received such a protocol from the foundation contractor. The protocol was a requirement from the house supplier, which I in turn imposed on the foundation contractor. I had no experience in the industry before this, so I relied on self-checks which I've now realized is completely idiotic.
@C.Lundin It is a basement foundation. The top of the cast basement walls should be +. 3mm according to spec, but there's a 16mm difference between the highest and lowest point and 11mm over 2.5m where it slopes the most.
The floor on the ground floor (the top of the joist on the basement walls) has exactly the same deviations.
The floor on the upper floor follows the same pattern but to a slightly lesser extent.
I understand that wooden houses move, but again, HUSAMA specifies the maximum allowable deviations on a newly built house.
/Fredrik
@C.Lundin It is a basement foundation. The top of the cast basement walls should be +. 3mm according to spec, but there's a 16mm difference between the highest and lowest point and 11mm over 2.5m where it slopes the most.
The floor on the ground floor (the top of the joist on the basement walls) has exactly the same deviations.
The floor on the upper floor follows the same pattern but to a slightly lesser extent.
I understand that wooden houses move, but again, HUSAMA specifies the maximum allowable deviations on a newly built house.
/Fredrik
@Snappahaneklanen Do you know if cold creep is a problem for thermosetting plastics like epoxy and polyester as well?