Hello, I am in the process of installing a tiled stove in my apartment, built in 1909. There hasn't been a tiled stove before.
The association has previously approved installations for fireplaces.
Currently, none of the flues in the chimney are used, so it needs to be sealed and a foundation needs to be cast, and it must be secured to the chimney with some form of metal construction since the floor structure cannot support the weight.
What I am wondering is how I should handle the responsibility issue. I am not used to procuring services, which makes it a bit more risky.
- So how should I apply to the association? What do I need to get in response so I don't take on more responsibility than necessary?
- How does the home insurance view it if I take on more?
What requirements should I place on the contractor? That they are insured? Take on the responsibility for x period of time?
Yes, it wouldn't be good from any perspective if, contrary to expectations, it starts to leak into a neighbor's chimney, or the tiled stove falls a few floors.
How should I think? You can sense that, unfortunately, I am quite confused...
All help is greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Christer
The association has previously approved installations for fireplaces.
Currently, none of the flues in the chimney are used, so it needs to be sealed and a foundation needs to be cast, and it must be secured to the chimney with some form of metal construction since the floor structure cannot support the weight.
What I am wondering is how I should handle the responsibility issue. I am not used to procuring services, which makes it a bit more risky.
- So how should I apply to the association? What do I need to get in response so I don't take on more responsibility than necessary?
- How does the home insurance view it if I take on more?
What requirements should I place on the contractor? That they are insured? Take on the responsibility for x period of time?
Yes, it wouldn't be good from any perspective if, contrary to expectations, it starts to leak into a neighbor's chimney, or the tiled stove falls a few floors.
How should I think? You can sense that, unfortunately, I am quite confused...
All help is greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Christer
I'm not very familiar with the details in such a matter. But you should involve the chimney sweep who is supposed to approve the construction. There are some pitfalls. For example, it is not certain that a wrought iron construction that attaches the plate to the chimney is approved. I know of a case (although more than 20 years ago) where a newly installed tiled stove had to be torn down because the requirement was that even if the house burns down completely, the stove must not be able to fall down from the chimney.
It's not as crazy as it sounds. The idea is that if the apartment below yours burns, and the floor structure (the metalwork) weakens, your stove should not fall and break through the floor structure below in that apartment, as it could open the way for the fire to spread downward, plus it could accelerate the spread upward to your apartment.
Now, I don't know if the requirement really applies. The craftsman who had to tear down was furious and claimed it was corruption. At the time, chimney master had "recommendation lists" with companies they recommended in their district. It was alleged that if craftsmen tried to work their way into the "wrong" district, the work was exposed to a completely different level of scrutiny than if it was a "approved" company. This craftsman worked in the "wrong" district.
It's not as crazy as it sounds. The idea is that if the apartment below yours burns, and the floor structure (the metalwork) weakens, your stove should not fall and break through the floor structure below in that apartment, as it could open the way for the fire to spread downward, plus it could accelerate the spread upward to your apartment.
Now, I don't know if the requirement really applies. The craftsman who had to tear down was furious and claimed it was corruption. At the time, chimney master had "recommendation lists" with companies they recommended in their district. It was alleged that if craftsmen tried to work their way into the "wrong" district, the work was exposed to a completely different level of scrutiny than if it was a "approved" company. This craftsman worked in the "wrong" district.
Super thanks for the help. And I agree, you don't want to cause harm.
In the quotes you receive, chimney sweeper inspection is included. It feels a bit like when construction companies bring in OVK, i.e., it doesn't feel completely independent. However, the inspections seem to concern INSPECTION OF MONTAGE + CONNECTION, i.e., is the foundation included? Is it always chimney sweepers who inspect the construction of the foundation, shouldn't it be someone more construction technical? Where do you find such people?
If anyone here knows how I should formulate the question to the board and what answers I need to get and what needs to be written into the minutes, it would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks, Christer
In the quotes you receive, chimney sweeper inspection is included. It feels a bit like when construction companies bring in OVK, i.e., it doesn't feel completely independent. However, the inspections seem to concern INSPECTION OF MONTAGE + CONNECTION, i.e., is the foundation included? Is it always chimney sweepers who inspect the construction of the foundation, shouldn't it be someone more construction technical? Where do you find such people?
If anyone here knows how I should formulate the question to the board and what answers I need to get and what needs to be written into the minutes, it would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks, Christer
The legal process is this:
Notification of modification of the fireplace to the municipality. Building permits are also required for any new chimneys and flue channels.
Usually, a completed application form, a floor plan showing the location of the fireplace in the building, a specification of the fireplace, and a control plan are required.
Typically, a mason specializing in tile stoves will assist you with this. They often refer to themselves as tile stove makers. It is common for the chimney sweep to pressure-test the channel that will be reused to see if it is airtight before the application is submitted. If the channel is not airtight, re-lining the channel or other repairs, such as rebuilding, are required. Lining a channel can be tricky because tile stoves often require a relatively large channel area. Some also line the channel with mortar for sealing, but opinions (among chimney sweeps) differ on this repair method.
In the start notice, the municipality specifies what you must report back to obtain a final notice. After the final notice has been received, you can start burning.
It is common for the municipality to appoint the municipality-appointed fire protection inspector (="chimney sweep") to conduct an installation inspection as part of the control plan. In discussion with the municipality, it may be possible to appoint another qualified person for the installation inspection, perhaps the chimney sweep in the neighboring municipality if more suitable.
I guess that since you need to alter the floor structure, there will be requirements for this installation to also be performed expertly and be inspected as part of the control plan. It is unclear to me if the chimney sweep should do this.
Notification of modification of the fireplace to the municipality. Building permits are also required for any new chimneys and flue channels.
Usually, a completed application form, a floor plan showing the location of the fireplace in the building, a specification of the fireplace, and a control plan are required.
Typically, a mason specializing in tile stoves will assist you with this. They often refer to themselves as tile stove makers. It is common for the chimney sweep to pressure-test the channel that will be reused to see if it is airtight before the application is submitted. If the channel is not airtight, re-lining the channel or other repairs, such as rebuilding, are required. Lining a channel can be tricky because tile stoves often require a relatively large channel area. Some also line the channel with mortar for sealing, but opinions (among chimney sweeps) differ on this repair method.
In the start notice, the municipality specifies what you must report back to obtain a final notice. After the final notice has been received, you can start burning.
It is common for the municipality to appoint the municipality-appointed fire protection inspector (="chimney sweep") to conduct an installation inspection as part of the control plan. In discussion with the municipality, it may be possible to appoint another qualified person for the installation inspection, perhaps the chimney sweep in the neighboring municipality if more suitable.
I guess that since you need to alter the floor structure, there will be requirements for this installation to also be performed expertly and be inspected as part of the control plan. It is unclear to me if the chimney sweep should do this.
Oh, what an answer!!! Thank you, I'll have to call the municipality tomorrow to check what applies regarding the inspection plan for the foundation.
P.S. all the firms I've had here have thought that plastering is the way to make the channel tight. What does the sötare dislike about the sealing method?
Again, a big thank you!!!
//Christer
P.S. all the firms I've had here have thought that plastering is the way to make the channel tight. What does the sötare dislike about the sealing method?
Again, a big thank you!!!
//Christer
I essentially agree, säckdragning is the traditional method to seal masonry channels that leak. However, the criticism that has been raised is that the repair is not sufficiently durable. The requirement has thus sometimes been reconstruction where leakage occurs so that the joints are completely filled with mortar or pipes.Christer Olofsson said:
There is a practical solution if the chimney sweep has a problem with säckdragning. Let the mason apply mortar to the pipe first if it looks worn. After this, contact the chimney sweep and order a pressure test of the pipe. Now it is most likely sealed, and everything is fine and dandy.
Thanks for all the answers. I had an extremely skilled Kakelugnsmästar over, who feels confident in casting a new foundation. However, the company bringing in Kakelugnsmästaen seems to hesitate as the municipality wants a technical description of the foundation.
And Kakelugnsmästaen doesn't really seem like the numbers guy, and the company I've been in contact with is having trouble finding a suitable designer.
...any tips on how I can get this moving? Anyone know where to find a designer?
And Kakelugnsmästaen doesn't really seem like the numbers guy, and the company I've been in contact with is having trouble finding a suitable designer.
...any tips on how I can get this moving? Anyone know where to find a designer?