Double sill plate and wall plate

[Mikael_L]

I have patiently tried to clarify and explain my problem in several posts now. The result? Even more questions instead of answers :blushing:

And no - not 225x45 beams - here a meter weighs 4.9kg I have 170x45 beams

Now I hope the quiz is over!!

I apologize, but I wanted to have all the conditions clear before giving advice that might not work.

I erected a 4-meter gable wall alone, with beams all the way up to the gable tip = 3.5 meters as the longest beam. Then it was 120x45 and about every other beam in place, the remaining ones I nailed onto the erected wall. I never calculated the weight, so I did a trial calculation now, and then calculated your wall and concluded that you had approximately 240x45 beams...? :x

Anyway, as many have already mentioned, there's limited advantage for you in making wall sections (as one thinks of when making prefab elements).

Erecting site-built sections alone isn't just about the weight; it's also quite tricky to hold it in place while it’s being fastened and then braced vertically - alone.

I would have divided the long walls into three approximately equal parts, the division depending a bit on the length of the timber, but roughly 2x3.5 and 4 meters.

Start by preparing all the standing beams, cut them to the correct length and notch out for a standing beam under the cap as a carrier. Bolt two long beams to the middle of the garage, with cc 2 meters, be careful with any floor heating. Build the first section on the slab, only place every other standing beam (cc1200). Only attach the cap or carrier at the top. A carrier might be preferable? Straighten the section so it’s exactly 90° between sill/carrier and beams and nail a diagonal brace of, for example, 22x95 raw board so the section stays straight.

Raise the section, support it temporarily somehow. Place 1cm thick foam sill insulation under the sill, align and measure the placement on the slab carefully. Drill 8mm holes with a hammer drill through the sill and in the slab with cc1200, - every other bay, and secure the sill with 8mm concrete expander and a solid square washer. Don’t tighten too hard, keep it so the sill insulation seals all the way, you can tighten more later when the roof is in place. But too tight leads only to the sill going in "waves". Plumb the section carefully and brace it against the beam in the middle of the garage floor, brace with, for example, 22x95 raw board in cc 2000.

Build the next section and do the same.

Now place a cap in a different length than the carrier, so they overlap. Nail the overlap with 4 four-inch nails or screw with 3 5x100 or 6x100 screws. Finish by toe-nailing in all the standing beams that are missing.

That's how I would have done it. And if you’re alone, you may need to create some items for temporary support, to lean the sections against, for example.

These sections weigh about: (all dimensions in dm) (4*25 + 2*40)*0.45*1.7*0.5 (density) = 69 kg, so lifting 35kg should be manageable for you, right?

 

[Mikael_L]

yes but - - dear god :@/ hard to say if one should cry or get angry
what was it I wanted from the start???
and then some forum gods pop up and advise me not to do so
just ask more questions without even giving a sensible advice or
explaining why they think it's dumb/foolish with modules.....

DO YOU ACTUALLY READ BEFORE YOU RESPOND???

It's dumb and foolish because modules don't bring any benefit for you. (And by modules, I mean what is often meant by "modules", i.e. more or less completed walls in module pieces.
And that you're considering making small short modules gives you the problem of getting a straight wall plate. Which, admittedly, could be solved with the technique of placing an additional wall plate on top, at the cost of significantly more thermal bridge.

 

[Niklas9]

well - - oh my god :@/ hard to say if one should cry or get angry
what was it I wanted from the beginning ???
and then some forum gods pop up and advise me against doing so
just ask additional questions without giving a sensible advice or
explaining why they think it's stupid / ridiculous with modules.....

DO YOU ACTUALLY READ BEFORE YOU ANSWER ???

We apparently don't speak the same language.
I will stay away from your thread.

 

[andersmc]

Aha ..... just right:

Then are these guys just out for a ride?
[link]

By the way, the subject has been discussed before
[link]

The construction industry is very conservative in some respects. They cling to methods long after they should have been phased out. In the '70s and '80s, pressure-treated wood in the sill was considered an excellent idea, but gradually the drawbacks became apparent. These treated sills are part of the "sick building syndrome" concept.

If you use pressure-treated wood for the sill, one of two things will happen:
1: The sill remains dry. Then nothing happens, but on the other hand, you might as well have used regular wood.
2: The sill absorbs moisture. It will not rot, but it will mold and emit the pungent, chemical odor typical of wet pressure-treated wood.

If you're not convinced, just bring a pressure-treated plank into the bedroom and keep it moist for a couple of months.

I don't know how Svenska Byggvaror reasons. It's possible they're more tolerant of odors in a machine hall.

Same with the Träguide's reasoning. Obviously, they're banking on the pressure-treated wood NOT becoming moist. They have requirements for the highest moisture content in the treated wood but not for the regular wood.

But it's your house; you build as you please. I will never set my foot (or nose) in it, so I don't care. That I would never dream of building a frame with pressure-treated wood doesn't stop you from doing it.

Good luck with the construction!

 

[Snailman]

Here's another unwanted answer, I have erected the framework for a garage and house myself, I skipped the idea of modules and instead mounted the sill and then stud by stud (toe-nailed) starting in a corner with cross bracing in both directions down to the sill, then after the second stud is mounted, you mount a horizontal brace, and then it's just stud after stud, I will do the same on the next house I build...

 

[Hobbit]

No answer is unwanted

I'm trying to summarize:

- No double syllables (especially not stressed)
- Shouldn't build modules but try to divide the long walls into sections and hope I have the strength
to lift them

Finally:

Got a whole box of anchor nails 4x100 d^_^b - for free.
Now I'm wondering if I can use them to nail the frame
Perhaps not everywhere but in particularly exposed areas
Otherwise, I have a Biltema nail gun for 90mm nails at home.....
Might be a luxury problem to use anchor nails for the entire frame, but otherwise,
I have no use for them........

Thanks for all the answers (and questions )
Promise to open a thread in social & project when I start with the project of the century

 

[FredrikR]

You can't use pressure-treated lumber in the frame. You can skip that part of the sill right away.

Doesn't this only apply to residential houses?

Hobbit
You really don't need 100mm anchor nails, the Biltemapickan with 90mm nails is enough.

 

[andersmc]

Doesn't this only apply to residential buildings?

See my answer #34

 

[FredrikR]

See my answer #34

The question isn't really answered there either, is it?
I seem to remember reading in another thread where the use of a 'syll' or not was discussed, that this only applies to residential buildings.
Then of course, one can continue debating whether it's 'smart' to use it in, for example, a garage (even if the standards possibly say it's okay).

 

[prototypen]

If pressure-treated sill is required for it to withstand moisture, the moisture can go through the sill and up into the studs, causing them to rot.
The sill should be kept dry, and then pressure-treated wood is not necessary.

Protte

 

[Eddi Thomason]

If you need to have pressure-treated sill for it to withstand moisture, the moisture can go through the sill and up into the studs, which will rot.
The sill should be kept dry, and then pressure-treated wood is not needed.

Protte

Exactly!

A classic case of overcomplicating.
A lousy solution to a problem you really shouldn't have!

 

[Snailman]

and if the printed syll gets wet, it apparently smells so much that you still can't ignore replacing it...

 

[Hobbit]

and if the treated timber gets wet, it apparently smells so bad that you can't ignore replacing it...

yes you can -
one of these on your nose
http://www.minimundus.se/popup/tvattostad/tvattklamma.htm
or one of these under your nose
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110121101957/uncyclopedia/images/1/17/SurströmmingOpen.jpg

it will work out.

 

[Hobbit]

Doesn't this only apply to residential buildings?

Hobbit
You really don't need 100mm anchor nails, the Biltema nail gun with 90mm nails is enough.

Yes Fredrik... but what else do I use the anchor nails for?
They're just lying around.
Do you perhaps have a need :wow: ?

 

[Mikael_L]

I have never seen anchor nails in that dimension. Aren't they usually only 35-45 mm?