Hello,
Over time, I've noticed that the bathroom door warps in the middle when it's closed, i.e., it doesn't lay completely against one of the frames in the middle, with about a 1 cm gap. The bathroom was renovated when we moved in, but we installed the doors, and I couldn't imagine that the frames would be crooked during installation, yet it didn't seem likely that a molded door would warp.
So yesterday I took a closer look, brought out the 180 straight edge, and quickly confirmed that the door is straight, but the frame is significantly bent in the middle!? So how could this happen? The door moldings follow the wall perfectly? So then I also checked the walls and it became clear that the walls are also significantly bowing in the middle, in some places more than 1 cm over 180 cm.
How could this have occurred? The bathroom is tiled, so if the wall were to bow afterward, the tiles would have cracked, but how can the door frame follow the wall as well as it does? I know I just placed the frames without making any adjustments beyond the usual? Yes, wooden boards can warp a bit if they sit for a while, but even if that were the case here, it's highly unlikely that they would bend in the right direction with the right amount.
The house was built in the 70s with a ground floor and basement. The basement is made of light concrete while the ground floor is timber joists. The house is clad with Mexican brick, giving the impression of a brick house even though it's fundamentally a timber house. The interior walls on the ground floor are primarily hollow and clad with 10–15 mm fiberboard. The bathroom likely has a different construction, and we've clad the hallway outside with renovation plasterboard over the fiberboard.
So what could have happened here?
Over time, I've noticed that the bathroom door warps in the middle when it's closed, i.e., it doesn't lay completely against one of the frames in the middle, with about a 1 cm gap. The bathroom was renovated when we moved in, but we installed the doors, and I couldn't imagine that the frames would be crooked during installation, yet it didn't seem likely that a molded door would warp.
So yesterday I took a closer look, brought out the 180 straight edge, and quickly confirmed that the door is straight, but the frame is significantly bent in the middle!? So how could this happen? The door moldings follow the wall perfectly? So then I also checked the walls and it became clear that the walls are also significantly bowing in the middle, in some places more than 1 cm over 180 cm.
How could this have occurred? The bathroom is tiled, so if the wall were to bow afterward, the tiles would have cracked, but how can the door frame follow the wall as well as it does? I know I just placed the frames without making any adjustments beyond the usual? Yes, wooden boards can warp a bit if they sit for a while, but even if that were the case here, it's highly unlikely that they would bend in the right direction with the right amount.
The house was built in the 70s with a ground floor and basement. The basement is made of light concrete while the ground floor is timber joists. The house is clad with Mexican brick, giving the impression of a brick house even though it's fundamentally a timber house. The interior walls on the ground floor are primarily hollow and clad with 10–15 mm fiberboard. The bathroom likely has a different construction, and we've clad the hallway outside with renovation plasterboard over the fiberboard.
So what could have happened here?
I think it sounds like the wall or door frame is subjected to a larger vertical load than what is appropriate. Plan and section drawings can be good analysis tools.
I have gathered some photo drawings:
Drawing: https://imgur.com/a/3UkGrzl or https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepvXMGFQy8h7ABVJQ?e=Pe22Gi
Info: The drawing shows the entrance floor and the wall in question is the one between the stairs and the bathroom.
Renovation: https://imgur.com/a/ix0NH6m or https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepwFvWv_4Zc5lbZUQ?e=gLhpXI
Info: The renovation of the hall was done in 2017 and included cladding with renovation gypsum and new interior doors. The transition between the basement floor and the entrance floor was difficult, here we chose to use fiberglass-reinforced gypsum that could be bent. In the transition, these were secured with several screws plus mounting glue.
Problem wall: https://imgur.com/a/7cnAWzG or https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepxsoy6Noz7_ddMYA?e=ouRnQy
Info: First and foremost, I want to mention here that about the middle of the stairs up in the attic above the wall, there is an exhaust fan. This rests on 2 solid planks over the roof trusses, so it should not affect the walls on the entrance floor. BUT if you look along the ceiling molding on this wall, you can see that the ceiling sags in one place, unfortunately hard to photograph as it's relatively minor. It has been like this since we moved in. My assumption is that when someone walked around in the attic, they might have accidentally stepped or temporarily placed something heavy here. It isn’t visible unless you are looking for it.
The wall towards the hall is relatively straight until you reach the area where we had to bend the gypsum. If you place a level on the toilet door molding, you can see that it curves inward slightly, in this case about 3mm. Inside you can clearly see that the frame bows inward, with the 180-degree level it becomes about 6mm.
In the photos, you can see that we made a couple of amateur measurements with a 180-degree level to illustrate the bulge we have now confirmed at the height of the mixer along almost the entire wall.
The shower cabin, however, is straight as if the wall were actually straight? Inside the shower, the bulge is slightly smaller.
There are a few peculiar observations:
1. The door frames were most likely straight when installed and even if they hadn't been straight, it's unlikely they would follow an already uneven wall.
2. The other walls are straight, even the stump to the right of the toilet door (from inside).
3. The shower cabin sits straight and nicely along the tiles, there is nothing at all indicating it would be bent.
4. No tile or grout is cracked.
5. The bulge on the wall is at the height of the mixer and unfortunately, the plumbing has been built into the wall here.
We have checked around this area, i.e. even in the basement space under the toilet, but there is nothing indicating a leak.
The house consists of a lot of wood fiber boards and these expand significantly upon contact with water. If there were a leak, you should see substantial damage?
Drawing: https://imgur.com/a/3UkGrzl or https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepvXMGFQy8h7ABVJQ?e=Pe22Gi
Info: The drawing shows the entrance floor and the wall in question is the one between the stairs and the bathroom.
Renovation: https://imgur.com/a/ix0NH6m or https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepwFvWv_4Zc5lbZUQ?e=gLhpXI
Info: The renovation of the hall was done in 2017 and included cladding with renovation gypsum and new interior doors. The transition between the basement floor and the entrance floor was difficult, here we chose to use fiberglass-reinforced gypsum that could be bent. In the transition, these were secured with several screws plus mounting glue.
Problem wall: https://imgur.com/a/7cnAWzG or https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepxsoy6Noz7_ddMYA?e=ouRnQy
Info: First and foremost, I want to mention here that about the middle of the stairs up in the attic above the wall, there is an exhaust fan. This rests on 2 solid planks over the roof trusses, so it should not affect the walls on the entrance floor. BUT if you look along the ceiling molding on this wall, you can see that the ceiling sags in one place, unfortunately hard to photograph as it's relatively minor. It has been like this since we moved in. My assumption is that when someone walked around in the attic, they might have accidentally stepped or temporarily placed something heavy here. It isn’t visible unless you are looking for it.
The wall towards the hall is relatively straight until you reach the area where we had to bend the gypsum. If you place a level on the toilet door molding, you can see that it curves inward slightly, in this case about 3mm. Inside you can clearly see that the frame bows inward, with the 180-degree level it becomes about 6mm.
In the photos, you can see that we made a couple of amateur measurements with a 180-degree level to illustrate the bulge we have now confirmed at the height of the mixer along almost the entire wall.
The shower cabin, however, is straight as if the wall were actually straight? Inside the shower, the bulge is slightly smaller.
There are a few peculiar observations:
1. The door frames were most likely straight when installed and even if they hadn't been straight, it's unlikely they would follow an already uneven wall.
2. The other walls are straight, even the stump to the right of the toilet door (from inside).
3. The shower cabin sits straight and nicely along the tiles, there is nothing at all indicating it would be bent.
4. No tile or grout is cracked.
5. The bulge on the wall is at the height of the mixer and unfortunately, the plumbing has been built into the wall here.
We have checked around this area, i.e. even in the basement space under the toilet, but there is nothing indicating a leak.
The house consists of a lot of wood fiber boards and these expand significantly upon contact with water. If there were a leak, you should see substantial damage?
Last edited:
I can't read the files. Neither as a link nor by saving them. Something is wrong.
the links work for me
https://imgur.com/a/3UkGrzl
https://imgur.com/a/ix0NH6m
https://imgur.com/a/7cnAWzG
https://imgur.com/a/3UkGrzl
https://imgur.com/a/ix0NH6m
https://imgur.com/a/7cnAWzG
I only get a black window on my iMac.
It's unfortunate that you're having issues with the links. I usually avoid uploading images that could be classified as private because you lose control over them; they cannot be deleted in the future if I were to wish so. However, there should, of course, be no problem viewing the images either, so I might have to reconsider.
3 links (Microsoft OneDrive) that might work better for those who didn't succeed with the previous ones:
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepvXMGFQy8h7ABVJQ?e=Pe22Gi
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepwFvWv_4Zc5lbZUQ?e=gLhpXI
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepxsoy6Noz7_ddMYA?e=ouRnQy
3 links (Microsoft OneDrive) that might work better for those who didn't succeed with the previous ones:
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepvXMGFQy8h7ABVJQ?e=Pe22Gi
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepwFvWv_4Zc5lbZUQ?e=gLhpXI
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AskujIssKpnegepxsoy6Noz7_ddMYA?e=ouRnQy
When you write "Over time" what do you mean? How long has it taken?
Edit.. and above are the wind and the trusses? It looks like you're saying there's pressure from above...
Edit.. and above are the wind and the trusses? It looks like you're saying there's pressure from above...
Now I could read the files. Is it a single-story house with a basement or is it a two-story house? (It doesn't really matter too much but still provides slightly different conditions) How is the floor structure between the floors constructed? Regardless of the roof construction, the wall between the stairwell and the bathroom should not be load-bearing, unless something has happened in the attic. Can you get up into the attic?
I installed the door in 2017, I can't remember there being any issues, possibly the door didn't end up 100% straight but well within margins. Then time passed and a number of months ago I noticed that the door (or the frame) is bowing in the middle, I thought that I should address and troubleshoot this. A few more months later, I have now started to focus on this.Ludde Jakobsson said:
When we painted the ceiling and installed the ceiling moldings, I noticed that the ceiling sagged at a joint. Tried to push the ceiling up but of course it didn't work. Took a look in the attic and couldn't see anything that would cause the issue. As mentioned, there is a large exhaust fan around this area but it is resting on the rafters, so it shouldn't matter. I could imagine the damage occurring when working to get the fan in place.
It is a small defect, it's not noticeable unless you look for it. But it is there and the first time I noticed it was because the ceiling molding didn't follow the ceiling very well, which has been fixed.
It is a one-story villa with a basement. The house has wooden floor structures, but I don't know exactly how it is constructed. It's probably a simple construction without any form of insulation since the basement/lower floor is furnished (220 cm to the ceiling).J justusandersson said:
I can access the attic, and I go there regularly to check that the roof is in good condition (it's almost time for a replacement). Between the roof trusses, there is thick insulation as usual, and right above the toilet, a rather large exhaust fan has been placed with quite a few ducts leading to various rooms throughout the house (including the basement). I have installed spotlights in the hall ceiling, and when I did, I moved the insulation around, and I didn't notice anything unusual then.
I have checked with a spirit level horizontally under the mixer and can confirm that there is also a small "bulge" here. You can faintly see it on the floor too as the grout is smaller right here.
There is strong evidence that the "problem" existed when the bathroom was completely renovated, but there is also strong evidence that it developed afterward. The question is which evidence is pointing in the wrong direction.
There is strong evidence that the "problem" existed when the bathroom was completely renovated, but there is also strong evidence that it developed afterward. The question is which evidence is pointing in the wrong direction.
What kind of trusses do you have? If they are truss-type (W-trusses) and an unskilled installer has cut off a diagonal member, you may experience a "local" sagging.