Hi! I saw some threads about soundproofing ceilings. I mainly want to ask about the results - if anyone has done it and felt the difference?
I have bought an apartment in a building from 1915 and the ceiling is very noisy. You can literally hear every step. Is there anything that can be done in this case? Can you reduce footstep noise? The association says it's not their responsibility.
Thanks in advance!
I have bought an apartment in a building from 1915 and the ceiling is very noisy. You can literally hear every step. Is there anything that can be done in this case? Can you reduce footstep noise? The association says it's not their responsibility.
Thanks in advance!
I have calculated measures and measured both before and after many renovations in older houses and yes, there is a huge difference if done correctly. Unfortunately for you, doing it correctly often means addressing the source of the noise, which your neighbors probably aren't interested in...
The association is correct, it's not their responsibility. It's the apartment owners'. The person who does renovations with a changed usage area (e.g., moving the kitchen) is also responsible for ensuring that applicable requirements according to BBR are met, and if no changes are made, there are no noise requirements to fulfill.
What you can do is build a dropped ceiling in your apartment. The dropped ceiling should not be attached to the existing ceiling but should be framed on the walls. There should be an air gap with insulation and be at least two layers of gypsum and leave one cm between the gypsum and the wall sealed with flexible sealant. The air gap should normally be at least 20 cm, but it can be calculated more precisely if the existing impact sound insulation is measured first. There are typical drawings on Gyproc's website, search for PS-02a.
The association is correct, it's not their responsibility. It's the apartment owners'. The person who does renovations with a changed usage area (e.g., moving the kitchen) is also responsible for ensuring that applicable requirements according to BBR are met, and if no changes are made, there are no noise requirements to fulfill.
What you can do is build a dropped ceiling in your apartment. The dropped ceiling should not be attached to the existing ceiling but should be framed on the walls. There should be an air gap with insulation and be at least two layers of gypsum and leave one cm between the gypsum and the wall sealed with flexible sealant. The air gap should normally be at least 20 cm, but it can be calculated more precisely if the existing impact sound insulation is measured first. There are typical drawings on Gyproc's website, search for PS-02a.
Thank you very much for the answer! I was afraid that there was no solution in this case. It sounds like it should work. Do you know if there are companies that work with the method you described? Is it expensive?
I haven't talked to the neighbors yet. They may have changed the floor or something similar that has affected the ceiling in turn.
I haven't talked to the neighbors yet. They may have changed the floor or something similar that has affected the ceiling in turn.
Hi, yes, there are some companies if you live in a larger city, which I assume you do considering the construction year of your apartment, but PM me your email and I will send you some contacts from my work email! Whether it's expensive is a very difficult question to answer, but the price for measuring and designing additional insulation should be between 10k-15k in simpler calculation cases. How much the construction costs afterward, I have no idea, but it depends more on the number of square meters...
Tool enthusiast
· Stockholm
· 1 399 posts
Great answer you got from DrGreebaum.
Regarding the cost, you can expect around 2 kkr / m2 and upwards depending on the conditions. This is calculated on 2 layers of gypsum that are decoupled with so-called Hangers.
Regarding the cost, you can expect around 2 kkr / m2 and upwards depending on the conditions. This is calculated on 2 layers of gypsum that are decoupled with so-called Hangers.
Thank you for the help! Just thought about two points:
1) What can be done about neighbors who have changed the floor, for example, without soundproofing it? I know they have removed a wall between the kitchen and the living room. It's not the association's responsibility, and you buy an apartment without knowing such details. It can be exciting with problem-solving
but this case is a bit too much :banghead:
2) As far as I understand, it's about a fairly high drop ceiling - 25 cm? It's unfortunate to lose 25 cm of ceiling height. Wouldn't it work with less height? I assume it would be less effective.
1) What can be done about neighbors who have changed the floor, for example, without soundproofing it? I know they have removed a wall between the kitchen and the living room. It's not the association's responsibility, and you buy an apartment without knowing such details. It can be exciting with problem-solving
but this case is a bit too much :banghead:2) As far as I understand, it's about a fairly high drop ceiling - 25 cm? It's unfortunate to lose 25 cm of ceiling height. Wouldn't it work with less height? I assume it would be less effective.
Check out sound brackets according to the link below. It allows for a similar construction but with a lower building height.MaxCorus said:
http://www.knaufdanogips.se/index.p...rofiler-innertak/produkter-innertak-ljudbygel
Tool enthusiast
· Stockholm
· 1 399 posts
The construction height has a significant impact on sound insulation as the principle is based on "mass - air - mass." You could say that these parameters form a "system" where different types of layers and the values of the aforementioned parameters determine how the construction will insulate sound (e.g., resonances, insulation level at different frequency bands, etc.). Generally, if the values of the parameters are increased, sound insulation is improved.
The solution described above is the most common measure in these contexts when there is no possibility to address the problem at the sound source (the upper side of the joists).
Just as DrGreenbaum says, it is wise to first conduct an insulation measurement to calculate which construction is most suited to meet the set requirements or desires for sound insulation.
The solution described above is the most common measure in these contexts when there is no possibility to address the problem at the sound source (the upper side of the joists).
Just as DrGreenbaum says, it is wise to first conduct an insulation measurement to calculate which construction is most suited to meet the set requirements or desires for sound insulation.
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Exactly, it's important to perform an insulation measurement first. Are there any companies you can recommend in this case?
It would also be good to know if there is a good insulation method at the sound source (top side of the floor structure) if I manage to "persuade" the neighbors Thanks for all the tips!
It would also be good to know if there is a good insulation method at the sound source (top side of the floor structure) if I manage to "persuade" the neighbors
Thanks for all the tips!For the neighbors, the most important thing is to lay the top floor as a floating construction if they change the floor. Regarding your question 1 above, it is a super complicated legal answer that I cannot answer, but the gist of it is that you can't do anything if they build "wrong." However, you can use this as leverage against your association to ensure that the association takes measures to meet legal requirements, and the association can then pursue it further against the neighbors. We'll see how that affects neighborly relations there but...
On question two, you understood it completely right. With smaller distances in the system, it could even worsen sound insulation for certain low frequencies, which might result in a perceived overall degradation of airborne sound insulation. The impact sound level is likely unchanged, and the difference between these two measurements is airborne versus structure-borne sound.
On question two, you understood it completely right. With smaller distances in the system, it could even worsen sound insulation for certain low frequencies, which might result in a perceived overall degradation of airborne sound insulation. The impact sound level is likely unchanged, and the difference between these two measurements is airborne versus structure-borne sound.