Saw yourself

[rcc_jkpg]

I have the opportunity to have all my timber for my house sawn at a smaller private sawmill. But the problem as I see it is that he cuts down the trees whenever he wants to saw something. So the timber is quite wet when it's sawn. Isn't there a risk of warping and poor-quality joists when the material they're cut from hasn't dried?

 

[Immobil]

Shouldn't be a problem. If you pass by a larger sawmill during the warm season, you can see that they water the logs before they are cut. Drying occurs after the timber has been sawn.

 

[lob]

Hi
Are you planning to build yourself? It's not always easy to get professionals to use "bonnsågat". They believe, perhaps with some justification, that it takes too much time to select, shape, plane where needed. But if you're going to handle the tools yourself, it's a different matter. I have built a small cabin with a loft using bonnsågat (well sawn) and it went well even though I'm not that skilled at building.

Best regards/ lob

 

[Ubbe]

All timber is dried after sawing. However, one should keep in mind that it takes quite a long time to air dry timber, especially if it is of a slightly larger dimension and the "wrong" season. For a sawmill, it takes about 8-10 days to dry the timber.

The drawbacks of rough-sawn timber as I see it:
* Uneven quality
* Large (relatively) dimension variations
* Uneven moisture content (evens out over time)
* Often rougher surface
* Varying lengths

Advantages of rough-sawn timber:
* Possibility of customized lengths and dimensions
* Price (depends on circumstances)
* Easier to buy "under the counter"

My advice is to compare the price of rough-sawn timber with a larger sawmill. It's not certain that rough-sawn is cheaper.

Sawmills with modern machinery produce timber that has both dimensions and surfaces that can definitely be equated with planed ("dimension planed") timber and sell length-packed packages in the quality you need.

 

[Baloo]

For a sawmill, it takes about 8-10 days to dry the timber..

Good lord, what kind of goa dimensions are those

 

[Haagbard]

The drawback of rough-sawn lumber as I see it:
* Varying lengths.

I see varying lengths as a big advantage, a major benefit of sawing on your own is being able to choose what you cut from which log. If you take some time to figure out the needs for the construction (especially regarding larger dimensions) and maybe even during the bucking, write e.g. 2"8 on the end grain, then you can adjust the log length so that only a piece suitable for the stove is cut off at each end!

Another practice I've applied is to saw everything to maximum width (perhaps even with some live edge), because the wider the planks and boards are (within reason), the straighter they become after drying. Then you can rip to the dimensions needed using, for example, a regular Jula Atika saw, resulting in very precise measurements for the timber! Especially 2"4 and primarily 2"2 cut from lower quality timber tend to look pretty awful after drying!

 

[Kruger]

Wet lumber is much easier to saw! To prevent the lumber from warping, it is kept under pressure during drying (stacked). Bonnsågat, of course, isn't as dimensionally accurate as store-bought planed lumber. The advantage is that you can customize the dimensions to fit your needs. You can also use lumber that can't be sold as anything other than firewood, discolored, or with some rot or deadwood. Cheap! The best would, of course, be if you could arrange for the lumber to be planed as well!

 

[Ubbe]

Good lord, what are those lovely dimensions

Depends on the moisture content we're talking about

Standard dimensions at the sawmill range from 16x75 to 75x225.
The moisture content is either 8% (carpentry dry) or around 18% (shipping dry).
The drying time for the different dimensions and moisture contents varies between about 3-14 days.

The solution is, of course, wood kilns.

Regarding the cost of sawing yourself, it depends entirely on your own circumstances.
Even if you own the forest yourself, it's not completely free to harvest and transport the wood yourself. (The equipment also costs a fair amount) It often requires quite a bit of labor as well.

Hiring a small sawmill also costs a bit unless you own it.
Add to this the time and cost of transport to/from the saw.

A little example from me.
I have a bit of forest located 70 km away. Last winter we had some windfalls (fine pines) laying there that my father harvested and hauled out with a snowmobile and then transported to a small sawmill for sawing and later home to me.
My father has about a 30 km round trip to the forest plot.

If I sum up the trips for this:
Harvesting = 2x30 km
Hauling = 30 km (with snowmobile)
Transport from forest to sawmill = about 200 km total (for me + my father)
Sawing (1 day) = 40 km
Stacking and covering = 40 km
Home transport to me = 150 km

So a total of about 520 km x 20 SEK = 10,400 SEK

The amount of sawn wood was almost a full load on a 1000 kg trailer (max load = 720 kg), so not particularly much wood :-/
Bear in mind that about 40-50% of the wood volume disappears in offcuts and sawdust.
Some special dimensions were also sawn that cannot be purchased in the usual way.

Note that I have not calculated any cost for the wood, fuel, or other costs for the snowmobile, sawing, plowing roads, own labor, etc.

The alternative that I think would have been just as good is to simply do a slightly larger harvest (with machines, of course) and sell sawlogs to a mill (then I even get paid for the "by-products" in a way) and then buy the wood that I really need.

Without having calculated it, I actually believe that it would be better for me to spend my time at work rather than putting time into getting "cheap" wood.
This even though I own the forest myself, have excellent opportunities to get it sawn cheaply, and also have good contacts in the transport industry.

 

[Baloo]

The solution is, of course, wood dryers.

And the dryers naturally come from Valutec, with the S 9000 control system

 

[fooney]

Depends on which moisture content we are talking about

Normal dimensions at the sawmill range from 16x75 to 75x225. The moisture content is either 8% (cabinet dry) or about 18% (shipment dry). The drying time for the different dimensions and moisture contents varies between about 3-14 days.

The solution is of course lumber dryers.

Regarding the cost of sawing yourself, it depends entirely on your own circumstances. Even if you own the forest, it's not entirely free to harvest and transport the timber yourself. (The equipment also costs a fair amount) It often requires quite a significant work effort as well.

Hiring a local sawmill also costs a pretty penny if you don't own one. Add to this the time and cost for transportation to/from the sawmill.

A little example from me. I myself have some forest located 70 kilometers away. Last winter, we had some windfalls (beautiful pines) lying around that my father felled and brought out with a snowmobile and then transported to a local sawmill for sawing and later home to me. My father has about 30 kilometers round trip to get to the forest area.

If I summarize the journeys for this: Harvesting = 2x30 kilometers Forwarding = 30 kilometers (with snowmobile) Transport from forest to sawmill = about 200 kilometers total (for me + my father) Sawing (1 day) = 40 kilometers Stacking and covering = 40 kilometers Home transport to me = 150 kilometers

Thus, a total of about 520 kilometers x 20 SEK = 1040 SEK

The amount of sawn timber ended up being almost a full load on a 1000 kg trailer (max load = 720 kg), so not particularly much timber :-/ Also remember that about 40-50% of the timber volume disappears in sawdust and slabs. There were also some special dimensions sawn that cannot be bought in the usual way.

Note that I didn't include any cost for the timber, fuel, or other costs for the snowmobile, sawing, plowing roads, own labor, etc.

The alternative I believe would be just as good is to simply do a slightly larger harvest (with machines, of course) and sell sawlogs to a sawmill (then I also get paid for the "by-products" in a way) and then buy the timber I really need.

Without calculating it, I actually believe that for me it is better to spend my time at work instead of spending time obtaining "cheap" timber. This is despite the fact that I own the forest, have excellent opportunities to have it sawn cheaply, and also have good contacts within the transport industry.

I think you should sell everything that's forest and tools! and start working with some form of statistics or something else dead boring ;D

And only hire in all other labor than what you're currently doing and work around the clock! Smart, right? You'll definitely earn the most from that

 

[AndreasK]

I felled about 15 pines and a few spruces on the plot I am going to develop, had it transported to the local sawmill, picked it up cut and ready, resulting in a total of four evenly loaded trailers.

In total, I paid 10,000 for felling, sawing, and transport of the logs.

 

[Haagbard]

When I sawed in '99, I paid 11,000 SEK for 170 logs, cut them myself, sold firewood and boards for 3,700 SEK = 7,300 SEK

Transport out of the forest = "work exchange"

Transport to the sawmill, 3 timber truckloads without a trailer = 1,500 SEK

Help at the sawmill = 500 SEK

Sawing = 6,462 SEK

Transport home, 5 tractor loads = Diesel cost

Everything except the sawing itself was probably "off the books" :

This yielded "enormous" quantities of lumber, almost too much...

A tip: Coffee, beer, and luxurious sandwiches keep the sawyer in a good mood.....a satisfied and happy sawyer cuts good lumber

 

[Immobil]

A tip: Coffee, beer, and luxurious sandwiches keep the sawyer in a good mood.....a satisfied and happy sawyer cuts good timber

8) Fully agree. If you then have logs without nails, he'll be in an even better mood.

 

[Ubbe]

As I wrote, the calculation depends entirely on individual conditions and how one values their own time.

When discussing felling and sawing, there is also a safety aspect to consider. Forestry workers and sawmill workers rank high in the statistics for workplace accidents.

If I make a new calculation with some figures off the top of my head that apply to my situation:

So if I harvest the forest rationally, sell it, and then buy pre-cut timber.

If I sell timber to the sawmill, I get about 350kr/m3fub + VAT (this includes felling costs, transport, road fees, etc.) The price is for the entire batch, including pulpwood.
If I buy sawn timber in whole packages, it costs about 1500kr/m3 + VAT, and transport home is about 100kr/mile + VAT (underground economy).

Then we can start calculating But first some more assumptions:
Pulpwood share in the forest =30%
Sawn yield = 45% (generously estimated)
Timber requirement = 10 m3

So, it costs me 15,000 kr + freight to buy the timber.

To get 10m3 of sawn timber, I need to harvest (10/0.45)/0.7 = 31.75 m3fub
For me, that timber is worth 31.75 x 350 = 11,112 kr
But on these 11,112 kr, I may have to pay 30% tax (depending on whether I can find equivalent costs). Once again, personal conditions play a role.
With tax paid, there are 7778 kr left.

In my calculation, I exclude the tax

If we lower the sawn yield to 40%, the figures are 12,500 kr and 8,750 kr, respectively.

Depending on individual conditions, one can, of course, tweak the figures a bit and arrive at different results.

How many hours does it take for an inexperienced forestry worker to cut 35 m3 of timber?

What I want to show is that it's not always obvious that it's profitable to saw yourself and that personal conditions play a significant role.

 

[Ubbe]

I felled about 15 pines and a few spruces on the lot I am going to build on, had it transported to the local sawmill, picked it up sawn and ready, it amounted to a total of four evenly loaded trailers.

In total, I paid 10,000 for felling, sawing, and transporting the logs.

How much sawn timber did you get from it?