Inflated invoice when the builder has ordered building materials
The best prices were not meant as best for you, but best for the builder!
I don't think you have a scoop as it is not to my knowledge illegal.
Do you have a written agreement, it sounds like a running account, did you have a budget? Did the builder stick to the budget?
Member
· Nuevo Estockholmo
· 3 529 posts
Don't understand why everyone is so obsessed with discounts?
The only thing that matters is what's on the bottom line.
What do you choose:
Buy regel for 10 kr/m and get a 10% discount
Or
Buy regel for 20 kr/m and get a 50% discount?
The only thing that matters is what's on the bottom line.
What do you choose:
Buy regel for 10 kr/m and get a 10% discount
Or
Buy regel for 20 kr/m and get a 50% discount?
The problem isn't the discounts themselves.hantverkare1 said:
The problem is that the craftsman deceives their customer by shopping at a place where the price the customer sees is unreasonably high. Then the craftsman gets compensation from the building supplier on the side. I think doing so to their unknowing customer is pure fraud by the craftsman.
What would it look like if it worked the same way in other industries? Would people accept, for example, someone working in elderly home care buying milk for 15 SEK/liter in a store and then getting a bonus around Christmas depending on how much has been bought at that store.
I think most would consider it a scandal if home care staff acted in this way. But in the construction industry, it seems more or less accepted. It indicates a rotten industry culture that it works that way.
I think most would consider it a scandal if home care staff acted in this way. But in the construction industry, it seems more or less accepted. It indicates a rotten industry culture that it works that way.
Member
· Nuevo Estockholmo
· 3 529 posts
I agree with that.
You have to be open with customers.
You have to be open with customers.
Member
· Nuevo Estockholmo
· 3 529 posts
That's not really comparablelbgu said:
...it should of course be added that my approach does not guarantee the best price, but I receive regular materials at a reasonable price without having to be "on" all the time. The craftsmen who do not accept the arrangement do not need to work for me.
Example: An electrician picks up items at Ahlsell where, according to Ahlsell's own "end customer price list," they cost 1500 SEK. The electrician pays 450 SEK for the items themselves and profits from the difference. Here, it's not just the tradesperson who is at fault, not just Ahlsell either, but the whole system, all involved are "guilty" of maintaining the situation.lbgu said:
I think it's good if more people become aware of the reality of this, because the (although small) part of the "blame" that customers bear by not finding out how it works themselves and also by accepting the setup by paying, might change if it's spread. What do I know?
...
The issue with the setup, in my opinion, is that E takes a markup and snatches the discount.
The model should be based on abT 06/AB 04 where E should purchase materials as cheaply as possible and pass the discount to the customer. Then E takes a fee of about 12% on materials to cover profit on turnover and admin costs and overhead.
But for private individuals, E snatches discounts and fees. Additionally, they take a fee on VAT, which I believe is wrong.
But legally it appears so. Or is there anyone with a reference to a court decision that shows otherwise?
The model should be based on abT 06/AB 04 where E should purchase materials as cheaply as possible and pass the discount to the customer. Then E takes a fee of about 12% on materials to cover profit on turnover and admin costs and overhead.
But for private individuals, E snatches discounts and fees. Additionally, they take a fee on VAT, which I believe is wrong.
But legally it appears so. Or is there anyone with a reference to a court decision that shows otherwise?
Why not? Consider that there are private home care companies.hantverkare1 said:
What is the difference between getting a customer to pay, say, 50% overprice for a liter of milk and getting a customer to pay 50% overprice for a pack of nails?
The only difference I see is that it might be a bit more glaring to deceive Agda, 84 years old, out of milk money than to deceive a homeowner out of money for nails. But legally, it should be the same thing.
It is completely comparable. Perhaps home care companies have markups on purchases.
I see two sides of the issue.hantverkare1 said:
One: Yes, it's the bottom line that counts. If the customer receives market prices (byggmax-prices!?) from their builder on materials, then it's good enough. But...
Two: If the builder, through unclear discount rates, state subsidy (ROT -> higher hourly rate), taxi-like conditions on driving, etc., effectively lands at an hourly rate of around 800+ kr/h, which is what more qualified professions cost, then it becomes problematic. At least in my book! Don't get me wrong, I think a skilled carpenter is worth 500 kr/h but not much more than that. This is based on what other services cost in society, general wage levels, and cost levels.
Of course, it's a free capitalist market, services cost what customers are willing to pay. And here the customer has a great responsibility!
The Rock Uncle: As someone knowledgeable, can you explain why the markup on materials should cover "overhead costs"? What are these "overhead costs"?
I have yet to meet a craftsman who doesn't charge per hour when they fetch materials + the cost of the drive.
I have yet to meet a craftsman who doesn't charge per hour when they fetch materials + the cost of the drive.
I think it's fraud. Suppose I call a company and buy a service "I need a computer." Then an invoice arrives for 6000 SEK that I have to pay, 1000 for the service of finding the computer and 5000 for the computer itself. That invoice is a copy of the original invoice from the computer store for 5000 SEK. But if I call the computer store myself, it costs 3000 SEK. The price of 5000 SEK is not available to anyone else, 2000 in markup goes back to the person who bought the computer for me.
The alternative is to say "we charge 3000 SEK to find a computer for you." Then you are honest. But you probably have to lower your price because you are too expensive.
This is caused by the bubble economy we have right now. Construction companies have it too good, so they become greedy.
The alternative is to say "we charge 3000 SEK to find a computer for you." Then you are honest. But you probably have to lower your price because you are too expensive.
This is caused by the bubble economy we have right now. Construction companies have it too good, so they become greedy.
If you haven't asked for a price quote before, then it can't be fraud, can it?
If you have agreed that you will pay a 10% markup on their actual net cost, that's another thing.
I agree that it's a problem within the industry. But I am critical of customers not asking what the final cost will be and then getting angry at the craftsman or supplier when it turns out to be more expensive than they anticipated.
If you have agreed that you will pay a 10% markup on their actual net cost, that's another thing.
I agree that it's a problem within the industry. But I am critical of customers not asking what the final cost will be and then getting angry at the craftsman or supplier when it turns out to be more expensive than they anticipated.