Is there anyone here who has installed a culvert in an existing slab on ground?
I have questions about this product.
This means I have to dig under the existing slab.
Make a hole in the existing slab, either by breaking or with a hole saw.
Fill it up again, maybe reverse horizontally by pushing with a plank?
Anyone who has done similar, who has tips, opinions, etc.?
And you others, who perhaps have not done it, but have experience with similar projects, please write a line.
Sketch of edge element and uponors bend.
I have questions about this product.
This means I have to dig under the existing slab.
Make a hole in the existing slab, either by breaking or with a hole saw.
Fill it up again, maybe reverse horizontally by pushing with a plank?
Anyone who has done similar, who has tips, opinions, etc.?
And you others, who perhaps have not done it, but have experience with similar projects, please write a line.
Sketch of edge element and uponors bend.
Ok, good! Then I'm not completely off track...
How did you handle the excavation and backfilling under the slab?
In my case, it's 1m to the corner of the foundation, so I want to dig as little as possible.
I have looked at maxitherm pex duct with 2 25x2.3 hoses.
It doesn't have as thick insulation/jacket as uponor equivalent.
I think it should be easier to handle, and it's easy to insulate with foam plastic in the pipe trench to compensate for the smaller insulation thickness?
It also takes up less space on the floor in the laundry room since there is a floor drain near the intended location.
I have already dug up to the foundation where there are pre-installed pipes cast in, where the collector hose will go.
The borehole to the heat pump is 3m outside the wall, and I plan to run the duct next to these pipes.
The purpose is to heat a garage of approximately 65 sqm with a fan convector, which receives heating water from a ground source heat pump.
Another funny thing I didn't know before...
If you take 12 160mm 7.5 degree bends of pvc drainage to make a soft bend, you get a radius of about 30cm.
If you take 6 160mm 15 degree bends, you also get a radius of 30cm, etc...
How did you handle the excavation and backfilling under the slab?
In my case, it's 1m to the corner of the foundation, so I want to dig as little as possible.
I have looked at maxitherm pex duct with 2 25x2.3 hoses.
It doesn't have as thick insulation/jacket as uponor equivalent.
I think it should be easier to handle, and it's easy to insulate with foam plastic in the pipe trench to compensate for the smaller insulation thickness?
It also takes up less space on the floor in the laundry room since there is a floor drain near the intended location.
I have already dug up to the foundation where there are pre-installed pipes cast in, where the collector hose will go.
The borehole to the heat pump is 3m outside the wall, and I plan to run the duct next to these pipes.
The purpose is to heat a garage of approximately 65 sqm with a fan convector, which receives heating water from a ground source heat pump.
Another funny thing I didn't know before...
If you take 12 160mm 7.5 degree bends of pvc drainage to make a soft bend, you get a radius of about 30cm.
If you take 6 160mm 15 degree bends, you also get a radius of 30cm, etc...
We (the plumber) extended a 4-pipe conduit to the garage when the house was equipped with geothermal heating. We core drilled out from the basement, in the same trench where the pipes from the hole were supposed to go, and then core drilled in at an angle downward through the edge beam in the garage slab. It turned out really well and neat. The small amount of fill material that fell out when it was dug under the slab/edge beam was shoveled back.
Nice to have responses and input, I have decided to go through with it.
However, I can't use a core drill in the laundry room in the house, as I know (via photo) that there is a heating coil there.
So, I have to chisel, and do it carefully to avoid damaging/patching the underfloor heating pipe.
On the other hand, in the garage, it would be perfect to rent a core drill, or hire someone to do it; I don't know how difficult it can be, most things usually work out as long as you try... so far
Another question, on the topic, it now feels important to complete the laundry room's waterproofing and floor so that the geothermal heat pump can be connected.
If I now chisel and fix things in the house, insert the culvert, cast a pedestal, waterproof, etc., in other words, get the laundry room ready.
Can the culvert pipe overwinter above ground, outdoors?
Are there any major disadvantages?
The only thing I can think of myself would be the degradation of the casing by UV light...?
FredrikR and Wilfa (or others for that matter..) did you use a tube to insert the culvert into, or did you pull it in, fix it, and cast it in place?
And by tube, I mean like the one in my first post, Uponor's bent tube, or equivalent in drainage pipe parts or another suitable tube?
However, I can't use a core drill in the laundry room in the house, as I know (via photo) that there is a heating coil there.
So, I have to chisel, and do it carefully to avoid damaging/patching the underfloor heating pipe.
On the other hand, in the garage, it would be perfect to rent a core drill, or hire someone to do it; I don't know how difficult it can be, most things usually work out as long as you try... so far
Another question, on the topic, it now feels important to complete the laundry room's waterproofing and floor so that the geothermal heat pump can be connected.
If I now chisel and fix things in the house, insert the culvert, cast a pedestal, waterproof, etc., in other words, get the laundry room ready.
Can the culvert pipe overwinter above ground, outdoors?
Are there any major disadvantages?
The only thing I can think of myself would be the degradation of the casing by UV light...?
FredrikR and Wilfa (or others for that matter..) did you use a tube to insert the culvert into, or did you pull it in, fix it, and cast it in place?
And by tube, I mean like the one in my first post, Uponor's bent tube, or equivalent in drainage pipe parts or another suitable tube?
We installed the culvert as it was, not in any pipe. When comparing different culverts, don't forget to check what type of insulation is around the pipes. If I remember correctly, it's PUR foam for Maxitherm and polyurethane for Uponor, meaning Uponor needs to have thicker insulation to achieve the same total insulation value. Insulating with foam plastic in the pipe trench is completely unnecessary. The culvert can lie outside over the winter if you can't get it down in time. If you're going to core drill, remember to do it at a downward/outward angle.
Ok, thanks for the info and tips.
However, I think that PUR-skum and polyurethane are the same thing.
Isolating with cellular plastic externally was just because Maxitherms had a smaller outer diameter in the jacket for the same pipe configuration. That is, less insulation thickness, but maybe there's such a small difference in temperature that it's not worth the trouble.
And on Uponor, I don't find as detailed technical data as usual...
However, I think that PUR-skum and polyurethane are the same thing.
Isolating with cellular plastic externally was just because Maxitherms had a smaller outer diameter in the jacket for the same pipe configuration. That is, less insulation thickness, but maybe there's such a small difference in temperature that it's not worth the trouble.
And on Uponor, I don't find as detailed technical data as usual...
Between thumb and forefinger, is a duct of 2x 25x2.3 sufficient to heat a garage?
Total duct length about 15m, including risers in the house and garage.
I would say yes, since I have a 25mm feed to two radiators in the house, first to one, then on to the next...
What makes me uncertain is that the house only has underfloor heating and is well-insulated, so I'm aiming for a low flow temperature.
Therefore, you need high flow or a larger area on the convector to get the required output...
House with two floors, total 186m2, 285mm insulation in the walls, 435mm insulation in the ceiling, FTX.
Garage 57mm, one 3m door, insulated. 165mm insulation in the wall, 340mm insulation in the ceiling, no windows, natural ventilation.
Nibe F1245 is the intended heat source, energy well drilled...
Can someone demonstrate that it's sufficient, or is it inadequate?
Total duct length about 15m, including risers in the house and garage.
I would say yes, since I have a 25mm feed to two radiators in the house, first to one, then on to the next...
What makes me uncertain is that the house only has underfloor heating and is well-insulated, so I'm aiming for a low flow temperature.
Therefore, you need high flow or a larger area on the convector to get the required output...
House with two floors, total 186m2, 285mm insulation in the walls, 435mm insulation in the ceiling, FTX.
Garage 57mm, one 3m door, insulated. 165mm insulation in the wall, 340mm insulation in the ceiling, no windows, natural ventilation.
Nibe F1245 is the intended heat source, energy well drilled...
Can someone demonstrate that it's sufficient, or is it inadequate?
Of courseWilfa said:I was quicker with my fingers than with my thinking! Of course I mean that Uponor's are insulated with polyethylene and nothing else
those are probably the two options available, and PU beats PE hands down in terms of insulation capability.Sent from my GT-I9300 using Byggahus