No, not overnight, but far from 10 years.Stefan N said:
I would definitely investigate whether you can change the roof angle or raise the wall to create an upper floor. It should be worth it.
What does the zoning plan say?
What does the zoning plan say?
But what is the problem really? Isn't it just a matter of lifting away the tiles over a couple of square meters at the damage and replacing the plywood and battens with new ones just there? Since you don't see any damage under the roof, it's completely fine. If the damage is limited to just that area, there's no reason to spend 150,000, or whatever the price tag might be, to replace the entire roof.
The surface of concrete tiles erodes slowly, causing the smooth surface to disappear and be replaced by a significantly more coarse texture. The coarse texture becomes a good breeding ground for moss and similar growths. If the roof pitch, as in the case of TS, is relatively low, the risk increases for water to take other paths than those desired. The detailed pictures of TS's roof clearly illustrate this. Concrete tiles have a realistic lifespan of about 40 years. It can be longer with a good roof pitch and less exposed locations, but it can also be shorter. I do not at all share the opinion that they can remain as long as they are intact. This can be said about clay tiles but not concrete tiles.
The damage that the roof underlay exhibits does not occur during a coffee break and not in a month. I also believe that the extent and nature of the damage suggest that there are more reasons than just one tile having slipped down. The environment under the tiles must have been favorable for rot fungi.
The entire roof must be inspected as soon as the weather permits.
The damage that the roof underlay exhibits does not occur during a coffee break and not in a month. I also believe that the extent and nature of the damage suggest that there are more reasons than just one tile having slipped down. The environment under the tiles must have been favorable for rot fungi.
The entire roof must be inspected as soon as the weather permits.
The roof seems to be on its last legs. Regular inspections are warranted. The under-roof is of a more delicate kind.
To the advantage of the TS, the conditions for a potential roof replacement are optimal. The gabled roof on a one-story with a favorable pitch allows for a roof replacement to be incredibly fast!
To the advantage of the TS, the conditions for a potential roof replacement are optimal. The gabled roof on a one-story with a favorable pitch allows for a roof replacement to be incredibly fast!
Renovator
· västra götaland
· 812 posts
Is it just me who doesn't see any ströläkt?
No wonder that moisture condensing against the roof tiles causes this rot, it can't make its way down to the gutters. I think there are many such places on this roof, and addressing this as soon as possible is preferable....
No wonder that moisture condensing against the roof tiles causes this rot, it can't make its way down to the gutters. I think there are many such places on this roof, and addressing this as soon as possible is preferable....
The roof has been in place since the 70s, i.e., it has been there for about 48 years, and so far, there haven't been any moisture breakthroughs. Actually, I believe this is only a problem in cases where the tiles cannot fulfill their function, such as when a tile slips down. In my book, I would say it's quite a successful construction, and of course, having battens and a membrane is definitely a good idea, a belt AND suspenders are always better than nothing.
What one can ponder is why the tile slipped down, maybe something fell onto the slab, like a New Year's rocket, a bird, or something else. Another possibility is wind, but then more tiles should have been displaced. It could also be, as I described earlier, that there's a leak further up, but at the same time, I don't believe the battens are sufficiently damaged for the tile to jump out of place.
The next step for me now is to ensure there's no leak higher up in the row. Then it's also time to randomly lift a few tiles to check the status, this has been done previously by both me and roofers, but it's never wrong to check again. I'll then wait a couple of months until summer when I'll do a new inspection. If it has dried up by then, I'll decide whether I need to perform a minor repair. If it hasn't dried up and it's not obvious where the water comes from, then it's clearly closer to replacing it.
As I've said before, if you're not the one doing the work or bearing the financial cost (150,000 SEK in this case), it's always easy to judge and point out that it should be replaced. But why should we replace it? We have no moisture breakthrough? We have no open hole? A tile has slid down and it's the first time this has happened to us in 3 years (since we moved here). For me, this could be pure chance as I don't see any direct cause for the tile to jump out of its position.
The roofers who looked at the roof a year ago said we didn't need to consider replacing it until we started seeing moisture breakthroughs.
This discussion reminds me of the one we had when we moved into the house regarding our sewage system from the 70s, many condemned it and said, rip up the floor and install a new one. We had the system thoroughly flushed and filmed and there haven't been any problems for 3 years now and I feel pretty confident it'll continue to hold for many more years.
Now that so many of you have condemned the roof, it'll be interesting to see how long we can make it last. Maybe it'll be done by summer, maybe it'll last another 5 years.
What one can ponder is why the tile slipped down, maybe something fell onto the slab, like a New Year's rocket, a bird, or something else. Another possibility is wind, but then more tiles should have been displaced. It could also be, as I described earlier, that there's a leak further up, but at the same time, I don't believe the battens are sufficiently damaged for the tile to jump out of place.
The next step for me now is to ensure there's no leak higher up in the row. Then it's also time to randomly lift a few tiles to check the status, this has been done previously by both me and roofers, but it's never wrong to check again. I'll then wait a couple of months until summer when I'll do a new inspection. If it has dried up by then, I'll decide whether I need to perform a minor repair. If it hasn't dried up and it's not obvious where the water comes from, then it's clearly closer to replacing it.
As I've said before, if you're not the one doing the work or bearing the financial cost (150,000 SEK in this case), it's always easy to judge and point out that it should be replaced. But why should we replace it? We have no moisture breakthrough? We have no open hole? A tile has slid down and it's the first time this has happened to us in 3 years (since we moved here). For me, this could be pure chance as I don't see any direct cause for the tile to jump out of its position.
The roofers who looked at the roof a year ago said we didn't need to consider replacing it until we started seeing moisture breakthroughs.
This discussion reminds me of the one we had when we moved into the house regarding our sewage system from the 70s, many condemned it and said, rip up the floor and install a new one. We had the system thoroughly flushed and filmed and there haven't been any problems for 3 years now and I feel pretty confident it'll continue to hold for many more years.
Now that so many of you have condemned the roof, it'll be interesting to see how long we can make it last. Maybe it'll be done by summer, maybe it'll last another 5 years.
Then you can consider whether you want to replace the roof or plumbing in a panic the day before Christmas Eve when it has collapsed or in a planned manner before it breaks. I definitely belong to the latter and replace long before it is necessary to be able to do it when I want.
I think most people understand that, a highly personal weighing. I want to be quite sure that a system can't last another 5 years before I take any action. I've learned that things often last better than you think, and you can also save a lot from it. To simply rely on the estimated lifespan of items is something I don't find sustainable, neither for the environment nor the economy.
In this case, I have a hard time seeing the problem. We have a roof that is 48 years old, but all the tiles are intact and there are no signs of water leakage or, for that matter, moisture (I continuously measure the moisture in the attic). You can see a bit of wear on the tiles but really nothing that causes major problems at present. However, a tile has slipped down, which is the first since we moved there 3 years ago. This has, in turn, caused a local damage to the underlying material which we are naturally reviewing given the construction.
Say this dries up nicely and we find no problems under the other tiles, what are the risks? What says the roof wouldn't last another 5 years?
See it from a work perspective. What is easiest is probably also the cheapest in the long run. Nils82 has a strong point. Roof replacement on a simple gable roof goes incredibly fast. Have a classic roof-raising party during the summer. In three days with the right friends (there are quite a few construction enthusiasts where you live), you'll have a new roof with boards, tar paper, counter battens, battens. You can haul up the tiles the weekend after.
If there are some older folks there, you'll also get beveled slats and properly mounted fascia boards. If there are many vents on the roof, it may take a little longer.
I attended a roof-raising party a few decades ago. It was the usual group of people. Some wanted to stand around and agree in detail on how things should be done. While they talked, the homeowner and I made a chute for the tiles and had sent down half of the tiles to some other doers stacking before the organizing committee could come to any decision at all.
Everything raced along until lunch. It was extravagant with beer and two shots of schnapps. Somewhere around there, things went off the rails. Before the evening, we had torn down the entire roof structure. Not without reason. The ridge beam was completely rotten. But it was a bit of a shock for the owner. Maybe he would have chosen a more measured approach if we had been sober.
The next day we had to find a sufficiently straight and evenly thick pine to restore the ridge. Six-meter logs on the gable. A simple cabin from the 1700s. Since the chamber was just a bit shorter, the log needed to be almost 11 meters. A nail-biter. Used medieval methods to get it up. Can describe the method if there's interest.
A tip from personal experience.
One becomes bold from beer and schnapps. At the age I was then, the body didn't get sluggish... unfortunately
So only serve light beer during the day.
Best regards, Findus
If there are some older folks there, you'll also get beveled slats and properly mounted fascia boards. If there are many vents on the roof, it may take a little longer.
I attended a roof-raising party a few decades ago. It was the usual group of people. Some wanted to stand around and agree in detail on how things should be done. While they talked, the homeowner and I made a chute for the tiles and had sent down half of the tiles to some other doers stacking before the organizing committee could come to any decision at all.
Everything raced along until lunch. It was extravagant with beer and two shots of schnapps. Somewhere around there, things went off the rails. Before the evening, we had torn down the entire roof structure. Not without reason. The ridge beam was completely rotten. But it was a bit of a shock for the owner. Maybe he would have chosen a more measured approach if we had been sober
.The next day we had to find a sufficiently straight and evenly thick pine to restore the ridge. Six-meter logs on the gable. A simple cabin from the 1700s. Since the chamber was just a bit shorter, the log needed to be almost 11 meters. A nail-biter. Used medieval methods to get it up. Can describe the method if there's interest
.A tip from personal experience.
One becomes bold from beer and schnapps. At the age I was then, the body didn't get sluggish... unfortunately
So only serve light beer during the day.
Best regards, Findus
You have a roof that is made as a budget solution with materials that have passed their best-before date. There's not much to think about. However, I have great sympathy for Findus's solution. There aren't many roofers who are professionals in the true sense of the word. You can get a lot of snaps for the money a purchased reroofing costs... A properly executed roofing with good materials should last at least 70 years.
So, I went up and inspected the roof today, here are some pictures:
1. 2 tiles up from the problem tile.
https://i.imgur.com/0QQP11E.jpg
2. You can see there are ströläkt.
https://i.imgur.com/AGxO1PX.jpg
3. No moisture damage here.
https://i.imgur.com/NoiZI7d.jpg
4. The tile above, no moisture from above.
https://i.imgur.com/tYNOLgi.jpg
5. The tile above the problem tile, some moisture damage from lower bärläkt.
https://i.imgur.com/y08qtKW.jpg
6. The slab that has slid down, here we can see extensive water damage. Even the bärläkt has taken quite a hit. However, it has been checked that it does not reach into the attic.
https://i.imgur.com/OKteb1J.jpg
7. No problems visible on other tiles in the row.
https://i.imgur.com/HL7iwMX.jpg
8. The damage is clearly limited to just this gap where the tile has slid down.
https://i.imgur.com/TAqPqaC.jpg
9. The tile below, here we can see that some water has run, which has swelled the untreated wood so much that the water could no longer flow under the bärläkt.
https://i.imgur.com/Bu7WBVz.jpg
10. No damage to the lower bärläkt.
11. No damage further down the row either.
The wood under the replaced tile was now dry on the surface, so I assume it is no longer leaking.
Also looked under a couple of other slabs, saw no problems.
The problem seems to be solved. We will do a new check in the summer and possibly supplement with some wood if needed. Maybe make sure there is really space under the bärläkt in case it leaks again.
I see no significant risks at the moment, which no one else seems to have noticed either, other than that it should just be replaced.
Of course, I agree that it's time to replace it, but I don't see any urgency. The roof could pretty certainly last another 5 years as I see it. We will let time decide if that's right or wrong.
1. 2 tiles up from the problem tile.
https://i.imgur.com/0QQP11E.jpg
2. You can see there are ströläkt.
https://i.imgur.com/AGxO1PX.jpg
3. No moisture damage here.
https://i.imgur.com/NoiZI7d.jpg
4. The tile above, no moisture from above.
https://i.imgur.com/tYNOLgi.jpg
5. The tile above the problem tile, some moisture damage from lower bärläkt.
https://i.imgur.com/y08qtKW.jpg
6. The slab that has slid down, here we can see extensive water damage. Even the bärläkt has taken quite a hit. However, it has been checked that it does not reach into the attic.
https://i.imgur.com/OKteb1J.jpg
7. No problems visible on other tiles in the row.
https://i.imgur.com/HL7iwMX.jpg
8. The damage is clearly limited to just this gap where the tile has slid down.
https://i.imgur.com/TAqPqaC.jpg
9. The tile below, here we can see that some water has run, which has swelled the untreated wood so much that the water could no longer flow under the bärläkt.
https://i.imgur.com/Bu7WBVz.jpg
10. No damage to the lower bärläkt.
11. No damage further down the row either.
The wood under the replaced tile was now dry on the surface, so I assume it is no longer leaking.
Also looked under a couple of other slabs, saw no problems.
The problem seems to be solved. We will do a new check in the summer and possibly supplement with some wood if needed. Maybe make sure there is really space under the bärläkt in case it leaks again.
I see no significant risks at the moment, which no one else seems to have noticed either, other than that it should just be replaced.
Of course, I agree that it's time to replace it, but I don't see any urgency. The roof could pretty certainly last another 5 years as I see it. We will let time decide if that's right or wrong.
It is likely that if you repair the damage, the roof as a whole can last a few more years. However, the installation has flaws from the beginning. If you don't address them soon, there is a risk that the re-roofing, when it has to be done, will be significantly more expensive. The ströläkt, which is raw board, seems weak and is too wide. The plywood lacks a waterproof layer. Everything must also be assessed with regard to a relatively low roof pitch.
But those flaws exist from the beginning, so with your reasoning, the roof initially had a lifespan of a few years. But now the roof has already been there for 40 years, so it can be concluded that this is not true. Apart from the minor damage and the wear of the roof tiles, the roof is still in pristine condition, so if the tiles last that long, the roof could still have 40 problem-free years after repairing the minor damage.
If too much water leaks in, the roof can last a while before it causes subsequent damage inside the house. So the problem with the absence of roofing felt is not bigger than that. BUT the roof is not as secure as a modern roof, and the tiles are somewhat worn, so the ts should keep an eye on the roof to avoid future moisture damage and should start saving for a roof renovation, but it's not much worse than that.
If too much water leaks in, the roof can last a while before it causes subsequent damage inside the house. So the problem with the absence of roofing felt is not bigger than that. BUT the roof is not as secure as a modern roof, and the tiles are somewhat worn, so the ts should keep an eye on the roof to avoid future moisture damage and should start saving for a roof renovation, but it's not much worse than that.