Hello to those of us who need to live healthily for a long time!
Pressure-treated wood and children/people don't seem to go together if you follow the Precautionary Principle?
Now, we've already got a patio with flooring, railings, roof, and stairs newly built out of such wood by a professional carpenter who didn't want to use a mask and such protection (but experienced a genetic tragedy). Replacing the wood doesn't seem fun; maybe find out what was used, perhaps close it for a year or cover it with a mat and avoid direct contact with the wood, oil, and varnish afterward?
We thought about buying a sandbox at Bauhaus for 349:-, but it has pressure-treated wood. Is this safe, or should it be covered?
What can be used instead for a sandbox and patio, untreated pine or something else?
"Impregnated wood is treated with wood preservatives
designed to protect the wood against rot and insect attacks.
It contains toxic substances like arsenic, chromium, and cop-
per. Therefore, impregnated wood should only be used when
it is really necessary, i.e., in places where the wood is exposed to
moisture or at risk of insect attacks.
Building a sandbox - which wood
should I choose?
Avoid pressure-treated wood, as it often contains dan-
gerous metals like copper, chromium, and arsenic, which
slowly leach out. Such wood is really only needed
under extreme conditions or when you want the con-
struction to last for about 40 years. And sandboxes are
usually ready for demolition long before then.
Instead, reinforce by regularly oiling the wood
or choose wood that is impregnated without heavy
metals."
www.kemi.se/upload/Trycksaker/Pdf/Broschyrer/bygga_2003.pdf
Pressure-treated wood and children/people don't seem to go together if you follow the Precautionary Principle?
Now, we've already got a patio with flooring, railings, roof, and stairs newly built out of such wood by a professional carpenter who didn't want to use a mask and such protection (but experienced a genetic tragedy). Replacing the wood doesn't seem fun; maybe find out what was used, perhaps close it for a year or cover it with a mat and avoid direct contact with the wood, oil, and varnish afterward?
We thought about buying a sandbox at Bauhaus for 349:-, but it has pressure-treated wood. Is this safe, or should it be covered?
What can be used instead for a sandbox and patio, untreated pine or something else?
"Impregnated wood is treated with wood preservatives
designed to protect the wood against rot and insect attacks.
It contains toxic substances like arsenic, chromium, and cop-
per. Therefore, impregnated wood should only be used when
it is really necessary, i.e., in places where the wood is exposed to
moisture or at risk of insect attacks.
Building a sandbox - which wood
should I choose?
Avoid pressure-treated wood, as it often contains dan-
gerous metals like copper, chromium, and arsenic, which
slowly leach out. Such wood is really only needed
under extreme conditions or when you want the con-
struction to last for about 40 years. And sandboxes are
usually ready for demolition long before then.
Instead, reinforce by regularly oiling the wood
or choose wood that is impregnated without heavy
metals."
www.kemi.se/upload/Trycksaker/Pdf/Broschyrer/bygga_2003.pdf
Hello
I have children myself and have been looking for a sandbox that is not made of pressure-treated wood. Finally found one at Silvan, it costs about 300. For health reasons, I would not let my children play in a pressure-treated sandbox... but the selection of "healthy" sandboxes is limited. If you live in an area where there are cats, a lid for the sandbox is recommended since your sandbox can easily become the cat's, and if the child then puts sand in their mouth (which happens..), there is a high risk of getting worms in the stomach...
I have children myself and have been looking for a sandbox that is not made of pressure-treated wood. Finally found one at Silvan, it costs about 300. For health reasons, I would not let my children play in a pressure-treated sandbox... but the selection of "healthy" sandboxes is limited. If you live in an area where there are cats, a lid for the sandbox is recommended since your sandbox can easily become the cat's, and if the child then puts sand in their mouth (which happens..), there is a high risk of getting worms in the stomach...
What the builder has encountered is in private a tragedy we can return to, a disaster I do not know. Nor whether it has to do with the wood, but the personal safety mindset hasn't always been top-notch when other jobs have been carried out, when I think of the best and the wife is a doctor, when we have offered to lend protection.
We didn't consider that a deck could be dangerous since everything dangerous should be prohibited, for example, our old jar of Cuprinol is considered dangerous nowadays. But when a sandbox was being purchased specifically for the little child, the protective instincts started to awaken again, and I am inclined to believe what is stated by Kemi.se until proven otherwise. You don't see much difference in this regard between a sandbox or a deck where the child is.
We didn't consider that a deck could be dangerous since everything dangerous should be prohibited, for example, our old jar of Cuprinol is considered dangerous nowadays. But when a sandbox was being purchased specifically for the little child, the protective instincts started to awaken again, and I am inclined to believe what is stated by Kemi.se until proven otherwise. You don't see much difference in this regard between a sandbox or a deck where the child is.
Right now, I am critically reviewing for action since we don't know the content yet, which can vary according to kemi's lists. However, a good friend who is also a doctor and has many children, responded similarly to above, advising to choose differently.
One can drink oneself to death with water, but only foolish people do that, much like with some other things. I deal a lot with risk assessment, one should read the origin of tomatoes, Spanish ones can be more toxic than Swedish but should be checked. In Spain, you have to use more pesticides in the heat when cultivating under plastic covers, but they have cheaper verduros where they harvest several times a year.
Wood preservation is a bit different, and children are the best we have. Those who don't protect children shouldn't have any. There is a law about the child's best interest.
It seems ridiculous that a sandbox looks simple to assemble, but this particular pre-built one with the highest price was so cozy, and we would receive it as a gift.
The deck ranges from light to darker green, and it was said it could lie under water.
One can drink oneself to death with water, but only foolish people do that, much like with some other things. I deal a lot with risk assessment, one should read the origin of tomatoes, Spanish ones can be more toxic than Swedish but should be checked. In Spain, you have to use more pesticides in the heat when cultivating under plastic covers, but they have cheaper verduros where they harvest several times a year.
Wood preservation is a bit different, and children are the best we have. Those who don't protect children shouldn't have any. There is a law about the child's best interest.
It seems ridiculous that a sandbox looks simple to assemble, but this particular pre-built one with the highest price was so cozy, and we would receive it as a gift.
The deck ranges from light to darker green, and it was said it could lie under water.
There are risks with letting children sit in the sandbox regardless of the material of the box itself. As you previously mentioned, children CAN put sand in their mouths, and that's not good. Personally, I don't think you should take that risk, after all, there is a law about the Best Interest of the Children. Laws should be followed.Annaman said:
If you still defy this law, you might consider a plastic sandbox, or why not just a big pile of sand you can place the child in? Don't forget to do an origin check of the sand, as there may be traces of exhaust from machinery and other things used in its production.
I was considering making a sandbox out of heat-treated wood (available at, for example, K-Rauta, decking timber for 19.90/m) but after quite a bit of sales talk about how Lundberg's sandbox kit is treated with an environmentally friendly agent, etc., I ended up buying one (with a lid that turns into two small benches when the box is opened).
Now I've contacted Lundbergs to find out the name of the impregnating agent. Here's the answer:
"The large sandbox is impregnated with Wolmanit CX and the small one with Tanalith E. This might not tell you much, but if you have access to a fax, I can gladly fax over some information about these substances."
Hmm... ours is treated with Tanalith E. Further searching shows first what the salespeople inform about:
http://www.tanalith-e.com (I still feel calm, it's a sweet, healthy baby crawling on the decking...)
Continuing on http://www.ntr-nwpc.com/sverige/sti/gdkn.htm where I see that Tanalith E contains something called tebuconazole... further searching leads me to this: http://cf.vgregion.se/miljo/miljosamverkan/dokument/kemtills05_traskydd_handledn_hela.pdf
"Is toxic to aquatic animals and plants and has caused birth defects in animal experiments"... I rush out to remove the sandbox.
I will use heat-treated wood instead... I have also contacted Lundbergs with this hair-raising information, let's see what the response will be...
Now I've contacted Lundbergs to find out the name of the impregnating agent. Here's the answer:
"The large sandbox is impregnated with Wolmanit CX and the small one with Tanalith E. This might not tell you much, but if you have access to a fax, I can gladly fax over some information about these substances."
Hmm... ours is treated with Tanalith E. Further searching shows first what the salespeople inform about:
http://www.tanalith-e.com (I still feel calm, it's a sweet, healthy baby crawling on the decking...)
Continuing on http://www.ntr-nwpc.com/sverige/sti/gdkn.htm where I see that Tanalith E contains something called tebuconazole... further searching leads me to this: http://cf.vgregion.se/miljo/miljosamverkan/dokument/kemtills05_traskydd_handledn_hela.pdf
"Is toxic to aquatic animals and plants and has caused birth defects in animal experiments"... I rush out to remove the sandbox.
I will use heat-treated wood instead... I have also contacted Lundbergs with this hair-raising information, let's see what the response will be...
it's dead easy to head to byggmax or similar and buy studs 45x170 and cut them into 2-meter lengths to make a fairly simple sandbox... it took me less time to do that than to dig down in the ground to add more sand ;D
cost, under 400pix... and it's exactly as sturdy as I wanted it to be... (can take a photo of it tonight)
cost, under 400pix... and it's exactly as sturdy as I wanted it to be... (can take a photo of it tonight)
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· Göteborg
· 11 228 posts
Apparently, there is now timber that is pressure-treated with linolja. Sounds like you could avoid the boring gray-green color.
Does anyone know who supplies it?
Does anyone know who supplies it?
It is prescribed to wear gloves and a mask when working with treated 
Woody has untreated for 299 with a lid, Silvan charges 329.95, I'll keep snooping at Fredells and Coop8)
Woody has untreated for 299 with a lid, Silvan charges 329.95, I'll keep snooping at Fredells and Coop8)
When my children were small, I had a sandbox as TiGGrE describes.
This was completely untreated. After about 4 years, we removed it when the children had grown too big to stay there; they preferred playing in the dirt pile after the extension. At that point, only the part that had been in the ground was rotten. If I had oiled it at the bottom edge, it would have survived the children's interest in the sandbox.
Manufacturers of pressure-treated sandboxes allow themselves to reduce the dimensions of the wood and thus save money, is my conclusion. Since there are no clear directives about pressure-treated wood and sandboxes, it's up to each person to decide how they want to do it.
This was completely untreated. After about 4 years, we removed it when the children had grown too big to stay there; they preferred playing in the dirt pile after the extension. At that point, only the part that had been in the ground was rotten. If I had oiled it at the bottom edge, it would have survived the children's interest in the sandbox.
Manufacturers of pressure-treated sandboxes allow themselves to reduce the dimensions of the wood and thus save money, is my conclusion. Since there are no clear directives about pressure-treated wood and sandboxes, it's up to each person to decide how they want to do it.
With the risk of being labeled an idiot: There is something called something like "heat-treated wood"? The wood pieces are heated in some way so that the properties change (it becomes more durable). I have seen this at places like Fredells, pieces intended for things like deck construction. I don't remember the link to the manufacturer (a Finnish one).
It might be something....
It might be something....
I bought a sandbox - kit - made of larch wood for the boys when they were little. The wood was completely untreated and it's said that larch wood is quite durable even without treatment. After 5-6 years, the wood started to rot in the parts that had contact with the ground, so I moved the timber into the sauna stove for further use...
Is it not possible to get such larch wood sandboxes anymore? ??? :
Is it not possible to get such larch wood sandboxes anymore? ??? :
The most dangerous thing you can do is breathe, so maybe you should stop doing that for safety's sake.
I grew up with a pressure-treated sandbox and a pressure-treated deck that I played on as a child. Yet, I am alive and have a healthy child.
Honestly, I don't think one needs to be too worried, the child doesn't exactly sit 8 hours a day, 365 days a year in the sandbox, as I said, you probably don't want to know what's in our "fresh" air.........
I grew up with a pressure-treated sandbox and a pressure-treated deck that I played on as a child. Yet, I am alive and have a healthy child.
Honestly, I don't think one needs to be too worried, the child doesn't exactly sit 8 hours a day, 365 days a year in the sandbox, as I said, you probably don't want to know what's in our "fresh" air.........