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46 replies
7k views
46 replies
Questions about passive houses?
A passive house is a house that does not need to be heated!
In short, the heat generated from electronics, people, cooking, laundry, lighting, and everything else should be enough to keep the house warm. Since a lot of air needs to be ventilated in houses with today's requirements, you need an efficient heat exchanger so that the air coming in is warmed by excess energy inside.
Personally, I think a passive or energy-efficient house should be built of stone because you can store much more energy in a stone house, but you insulate it from the outside so it results in an even indoor climate.
However, as everything becomes more and more energy-efficient, more insulation is required, and building a house without a heating system, I think, is completely foolish, even though you shouldn't insulate poorly for that reason.
In short, the heat generated from electronics, people, cooking, laundry, lighting, and everything else should be enough to keep the house warm. Since a lot of air needs to be ventilated in houses with today's requirements, you need an efficient heat exchanger so that the air coming in is warmed by excess energy inside.
Personally, I think a passive or energy-efficient house should be built of stone because you can store much more energy in a stone house, but you insulate it from the outside so it results in an even indoor climate.
However, as everything becomes more and more energy-efficient, more insulation is required, and building a house without a heating system, I think, is completely foolish, even though you shouldn't insulate poorly for that reason.
Yes you can, http://www.bestahus.se/ is an example. This company has been around for a while and has sold kits where the core of the walls consists of cellplast/"styrofoam" and plywood on each side of the cellplast block. The kits have consisted of a bunch of blocks (e.g. 100cm x 35cm) that have come numbered + an 'ikea' drawing of where to place the blocksmiry said:...
then I doubt that anyone can build a passive house with styrofoam since it cannot store heat and cold, but I have seen somewhere where they inflated a dome or a tent-like structure that they then sprayed PU foam over, so when it hardens it becomes a strong and well-insulated construction but very light which needs to be anchored in the ground
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Passive houses are based on the principle that the house is heated by waste heat from the appliances you use as well as body heat from the residents. Because of this, the solution is sensitive to how many people are at home and using things. If, for example, you are on vacation in Thailand while it gets cold, the indoor temperature can become tricky.kamilenski said:
Therefore, you should have a secondary heating system, but since it will hopefully be used very little, I would consider something cheap like a couple of regular electric heaters.
How would it work with an air-source heat pump then? Cooling during extreme heat and forced heating (the battens would distribute it) during extreme cold?mats_o said:Passive houses are based on the principle that the house should be heated with waste heat from the appliances you use and body heat from the residents.
Since this is the case, the solution is sensitive to how many people are at home and using things.
For example, if you are on vacation in Thailand while it gets cold, it can be tricky with the indoor temperature.
Therefore, you should have a secondary heating system, but since it should hopefully be used very little, I would consider something cheap like a couple of regular electric heaters
/My entire reasoning is based on construction in Skåne! I actually have a plot that I need to apply for a building permit on.
What do you think about the following:
Roof.
Roof tiles
Under-roof plastic
Light beams http://www.sjomarkens.se/lattbalk/index.html
50cm cellulose insulation / no air gap
0.2 plastic
Wood paneling
Wall
Plaster
Ytong 300
Polystyrene 2x 100
Plaster
Floor
400mm polystyrene
100 concrete
Tiles
Heating
FTX
LLVP Just in case.
Electric underfloor heating in the bathroom
Electric water heater + solar panels
Roof.
Roof tiles
Under-roof plastic
Light beams http://www.sjomarkens.se/lattbalk/index.html
50cm cellulose insulation / no air gap
0.2 plastic
Wood paneling
Wall
Plaster
Ytong 300
Polystyrene 2x 100
Plaster
Floor
400mm polystyrene
100 concrete
Tiles
Heating
FTX
LLVP Just in case.
Electric underfloor heating in the bathroom
Electric water heater + solar panels
I imagine they have a load-bearing frame in those walls, like a wooden frame, but then you would get good stiffness by making sandwich elements with PU foam bonded to two plywood panels on either side.lt1cobra said:Sure, you can do that, [link] is an example. This company has been around for a while and has sold building kits where the core of the walls consists of foam/"styrofoam" and plywood on each side of the foam block. The kits consisted of a bunch of blocks (e.g. 100cm x 35cm) that came numbered + an 'IKEA' drawing of where to place the blocks. I have a friend who built one and it's still standing, there are certainly plenty of arguments for/against foam in the walls, but I don't know much about that. Last I heard, Fiskarhedenvillan bought into this company, so their versions of houses will likely appear as "low-energy houses" in the fall ([link]).
What I was referring to was where they set up a tent or a shell that they blow foam onto from one side only, but I haven't seen such constructions in Sweden, and here when it's used, there is a load-bearing structure that is then insulated, thus resulting in very few thermal bridges.
but then it won't be a passive house but an energy-efficient house and now you understand why I'm skeptical about passive houses and that they don't work so well for winter holidays or are uncertain if they will suffice with tomorrow's energy-efficient products that do not generate significant heatkamilenski said:What would you think of the following:
Roof:
Roof tiles
Under-roof plastic
Light beams [link]
50cm cellulose insulation / no air gap
0.2 plastic
Wood paneling
Wall:
Plaster
Ytong 300
Styrofoam 2x 100
Plaster
Floor:
400mm Styrofoam
100 concrete
Tiles
Heat:
FTX
LLVP Just in case.
Electric underfloor heating in the bathroom
Electric water heater + solar panels
when it comes to your house, how you've planned it, it should include more things to make it right, but regardless, the principle is clear. You should have the insulation on the outside of the energy-storing material, so the outer walls should be plaster/gypsum inside and then leca/ytong, and outside of that comes the insulation. This way, you utilize the material's inertia to achieve an even and comfortable indoor temperature. This is advantageous when there are cold snaps or heat spikes for a few hours in the summer, as the walls absorb the heat, and it's beneficial to utilize that heat when it gets colder at night.
and with a reasonably sized LLVP, you can ensure you manage all year with it as the sole heat source.
get yourself a good FTX, as some are not worth their cost.
the question is whether the FTX is profitable in that situation.
I don't have a precise understanding of the efficiency of new units, but I know that an older one wasn't profitable to connect to a geothermal heating system.
I don't have a precise understanding of the efficiency of new units, but I know that an older one wasn't profitable to connect to a geothermal heating system.
One becomes afraid to build without a heat source in stone.mats_o said:
Hope someone knows a bit more about modern FTX.
The passive house can manage without a heating source during normal use. However, you MAY have active heating if you wish. A wood stove is one option. Many have some kind of heat exchanger for the FTX. You are more or less forced to have some heating to handle extreme situations. Also, remember that the passive house is not just a matter of insulation. Windows and doors are extremely important, both in terms of U-value, size, and placement. The house's layout and location also play a role.